Senin, 17 April 2017

asking alexandria hiatus

asking alexandria hiatus

so you should be good. use hashtag identity weekand if you'd like to tag us and follow us as well,it's @mrsamuelfrench and just to note that next week,because of identity week, we're shifting and changing our twitterhandle to @samuelfrenchnyc, so if you see that change, that's why. get the wifi, everybody is good i see,looking at their phones, awesome. and yes, we're so excited for our panelistand moderator. so i'm going to hand it over to them now,adam hetrick is our moderator

for today, the editor in chiefof playbill.com. go on, sneak inand we're going to bring them out on stage and get started,have fun! (audience clapping) hi everyone, thank you for joining us. hi so nice to see all of you,my name is adam hetrick, and i'm the editor in chiefof playbill.com. we're thrilled to partner with sam frenchthis week, this year for identity week. this evening i'm joined by an incrediblegroup of panellist, all whom i'll let

introduce themselves to you tonight. my name is donnie cianciottoand my pronouns are he, him and his. hi my name is pooya mohseni,i'm a her if there ever was one. (all laughs) hi, i'm bianca leigh,she, her. hello, i'm mj rodriguez,and she and her are very perfect to me. hi, i'm azure d. osborne-lee,i'm he, him or they, them. this evening we will be discussinga lot of-- some topics that cover the identityand lives of transgender artist

onstage and off. and i think this week, we had a chanceto speak backstage a bit, something we wanted to start off onis sort of the claiming of the trans identity and how thatblossomed as an artist and that opened up artistic channelsfor each of you in your own personal lives and your professional lives. umm, well for me, it was somethingi didn't necessary anticipate happening, i had, you know, been an actormy whole life and have gone to college for musical theatre and that was beforei had come out, started transitioning

and when i did that, i was 30 years oldand i kind of thought, "well, there goes my musical theatrecareer" because my voice is going to changeand who's going to hire the trans guy. and about four years later,i saw an opened audition call for a show called southern comfort at the publictheatre that said they were specifically looking for transgender actorsand i had not really done anything for four years because of the transitionand so in my case, you know when i thought that transitioningwas going to be the thing that closed the door and shut off any opportunities,it totally opened this-- this door for me

and i ended up getting the part,moving from arizona to new york to do the show and have workedhere now, a couple of times because there are looking for specificallytransgender actors. so, here i thought that i was shootingmyself in the foot by coming out, instead it was one of the best careerchoices i've could have made. (all laughs) i transitioned many years ago,about 18-19 years ago and at that time new yorkwas less accepting and so my aspirations of being an actorand model at that time were rather

futile, people wouldn't returnmy phone calls and all of that. so i left the business becauseat that time i saw there was really no room for me and i really wantedto transition and that's why i come to this country to be able to do thatand many years later, kind of acting found meand at this point, i had transitioned and i was livingcomfortably and stuff. and then about a year ago,about a year and a half ago, i started thinking that it's not enough,i have to come out, i want to come out, i need to have a voiceand the day that marriage equality

passed at supreme court,i decided this is the day, well i thought well, my acting careerokay goodbye, whatever i had, this is going to be it. i publicly came out and wouldn't you knowthat was not it. it, like donnie was saying, it gave thisother side to my career, but not just my acting career,i got to talk about things that were important to me. i can talk about things that feltweren't being talked about and i got to talk about it with authority,not in a third person kind of voice.

so i feel me coming out opened differentavenues to me as an artist and also gave me a voice to sharewith other people as a transwoman, who was alsoa performer and a writer and i'm very grateful for that voice. hi, well, i'm not going to be quiteas positive. so, buckle your seat belt--no just kidding. for me, it's a double edge sword. i transitioned over 30 years ago. i was five years old-- no.

(all laughs)- yes you were, yes you were. i was the first trans-childand i remember you know, my acting teacher [racher], she said:"okay, that's what you want to do, do it, but stick with theatre, you know,slip in there because hollywood wants nothing to do with it,they're much more conservative out there, and they're much more afraid." so, i moved to new york, i think, one of the thing i knewi always identified as a female always. but i did go to acting to schoolas a male and one of the things

that kept coming back to meevery time we did a scene or i was cast in a show, i didn't getthe part that i really wanted. the part that i really wanted was a femaleso really kind of convinced me that that truly is how i identifythose-- that's the perspective that i share. so, i transitioned and i was very youngand a little naive. i was lucky enough, doors were closedto me, i was very lucky. there's a very thin layer of theatre,you have legit, you know, equity stuff and you have all that stuffthat doesn't pay

and then there's a small layerthat does pay that's usually for grants, things like that and i was ableto be a working trans actress for many years in new york. nothing huge, nothing that would blowyour socks off, but i was very grateful for that and for the downtown artistthat cast me, collaborated with me. my goal is one day not to be seenas a trans actress but an actress who knows her shit. who happens to be transand i think that is, you know, where a lot of people, you know,when it comes to alternative casting,

you want to be castbecause of your talent. your dream is to have a characterthat happens to be trans. isn't necessarily transor may not be trans. sometimes when you keep playingtrans characters, sorry, i don't want to look at giftstowards the mound, you sort of end up saying the samekind of things, over and over. and you think, i am a transexual,i don't want to play one over and over, and over, i want to play everything. doctors, lawyers, you know, astronauts.

all these different stories, that's whyi got involved with this to begin with. so on the one hand, i'm thrilled,doors are-- i know what i'm talking a lot, sorry. but i won't, i got a lot to say. the doors are opening up,and people want to help and they want to write these charactersand want to cast us, more and more and i feel that's great and i'm very happyfor that, like i said, i want more, what can i say. that's beautiful.

for me, i had always though of myselfas a little girl in my head. i always thought of myselfas a little girl for ever since age seven and i knew, i was praying to godlike please make me this thing. wonderful girl. and then i found out down the linethat was going to happen but it wasn't going to happenlike how i expect it to. i was going to magically wake upa woman one day. i had to become one. and one of the most defining momentsfor people actually--

before that defining moment,i had a long process of figuring that out, when i had gotten a show called rent,where i played angel. i was playing one of my dream rolesbut at that point, it wasn't enough for me in my mind, i was going into--i was leaving out of backstage door and i was seeing all these peopleand they saw me as someone that i didn't see myself asand i was like: "okay, this has got to change, i started gettingyou know, trans roles." but it's still wasn't enoughuntil five years down the line, when i decided to chemically transitionedthat i started going on hrt

and really figuring out time thinkingabout who i truly wanted to be for myself and not anyone else. that's when it happened. and recently i've gotten called infor a cis role and i thought it was the most beautifulthing ever, because one, it shows that this worldis changing and that they're starting to see us as normal individualsbecause we are and-- tell them what the role is. oh, i got called in for peggy for hamiltonand i got a bunch of callbacks,

(clapping)- thank you. it was the most defining moment in my lifebecause it showed diversity within the musical theatre realmand that there is a possible chance that there will be soon, someday,a trans woman or trans man on a broadway stage, it hasn't happenedyet but it will happen soon. i think that was one of the most amazingmoments of my life and as a trans woman,it speaks volumes. it speaks volumes, so yeah. so i'm going to ask you to repeatthe questions.

(loud laughter)[inaudible] i was asking everyone how claimingyour trans identity also helped the way of artistic identity came forthand blossomed. i mean, yet to be seen, i don't knowthat it's helped, but i feel like it is,it is a part of who i am, so i started out theatre as a performeras an actor and sort of my freaky weird kid story, you know, like i reada lot of scifi and fantasy and also have been very wilful, you know,when i was in middle school, i just insisted that i should beconsidered for all roles, you know,

like male or female, like whateveri can play anything and so, you know, i playedsquire trelawney in treasure island as well as the voice of everyonewho fell overboard. (all laugh)- backstage so i was just like a big manly yell. and my parents just kind of let me dowhat i wanted to do. i mean, they're engineers and i thinkthey were just happy that i was out of trouble with them most partand-- goodness i have a story that i tellin high school about coming to school

one day, and i was dressed as half man,half woman and everybody was like did you parents see you?and i was like yeah, i drove to school with my dad because i was gettingmy learners permit. and so i identify as non binary,i'm not a binary trans person and so, fast forward to my mid twenties,i'm getting ready to go to school for experimental theatre in london. i'm back home in texas watchingtrue blood and then i was like oh shit, i've realised something about myselfand i'm not going to deal with this right now, because i was getting readyto move to london.

so i move to london, i did that,realised that i was trans and needed to transition but didn't tellanybody because i was like, i don't even know if i'm going to talkto you people anymore, after i leave here i was very cleari'm not going to stay in london. so i came back to new york cityand for me, there was really a pause in my arts career. i feel like for many trans people,the decision to medically transition is a decision to take a step backfrom working in a way that you're familiar with working and so,that's when--

i became an arts administrator,which is very important to my career as an artist and very much who i am,as well as a artist, i'm an arts administrator. and so, now i'm writing plays,people are asking me to audition for stuff which is kind of weird to mebecause i haven't really-- i don't even have like recenthead shots really. like my head shots are from likewhen i was like 24. and still living as a woman. i have a selfie, it's a very nice selfie.

(all laughs) that i use for the head shot,but anyway, because i do things like this and people are looking for--especially if they're looking for any kind of like black trans,male actor like geez, i would get that casting notice,like that break downs would come across my desk 25 timesbecause people don't know where to find them right? people-- i actually have an auditionnext saturday because people are like you want to come audition for this showand i'm like yes? i would do that? and they're asking me to include mein things and i--

to be honest with you, i do feel likeit's part of the trendiness of transness. but i also understood, when i stepped awayfrom acting, when i was living as a black woman, there was a limitationroles that were available to me and that i was not prepared to bein a situation to be judged based on my looks and like,this black don't crack, look i'm 32, i look good, you know,and i don't look old enough to play the roles that were out thereand i knew that about myself. you have to know what you look likeas an actor in this town. you have to know.

so, yes, i'm getting asked to do thingsbecause i'm trans, but also i feel like people get askedto do things all the time for reasons that don't have anythingto do with how talented they are or how hard they work,who they know, what they look like, what door they walked in,how much money they have. so, while i do get asked to do thingsbecause i'm trans, that's fine i'll take it,especially if it pays. well, i'd like to add something thatyou all touched on, the sort of intersection of being transand politics and they're sort of like--

there's power invisibility right now,and as you said, there's also a great desire to move beyondstrictly being cast as trans role. only telling trans stories,where do you feel you are now as a community, as an individual? and is there an ultimate goal thatone day that-- i know for pooya, you certainly say that it was a verypolitical act for you to identify and come out as you say. are you ready to move on beyondthese stories, is there a day that you hope you get to move on.

well, i'm going to start thisbecause there was something bianca said and it actually pertains what you asked. you know there was a time thati thought i don't want to play trans characters before i came out,i didn't want to be thought of, remembered as a trans character. but viola davis will never be askedto play a white woman. because there is a range of femalecharacters, that can be african american and they can be varied and they canhave different temperament, different background, well nobody wouldever say well aren't you tired of playing

black woman? or meryl streep playing a white woman. i am a trans woman, i embrace it,i have worked so hard to get to where i am. i have-- i have bled and criedand i have seen people that their voices are never going to be heard. i have no problem now playing a transcharacter, what i do have a problem with is people seem to think there's only onekind of trans character and there isn't, there are trans doctors,there are trans engineer,

there are trans mothers,there are trans hookers, there are people who transitionmuch later in life. (mj laughs)- i gave her a look, i'm sorry. i'm not a hooker, i promise you. well you know, i always sayis the matter of how much you get paid. but, i think for me personallyand i always want to say this because even though we all happento be trans, i promise you, there's no trans agenda if there is,nobody sent me an invite. there's no such thing as transgenderism,i hate that word, i really hate that word.

- no such word- there's no "ism", no "ism". the same way there's no straightismor gayism. unless there is? - not aware of it.- the transgender is an adjective. - it's not a noun.- yes, you don't transgender into something, you are. and when i look at that, i think,i would like to be that voice. not necessarily for something politicalbecause we happen to be part of the fabric of society, some of us are mothers,some of us are single,

some of us have had easier timetransitioning, you know again, we come-- i mean look at us,there's five of us here and we all have very different journeysthat brought us to here. sure, if somebody wants to cast mein a sis character because essence wise and you know,slight talentwise, i'm right for it i wouldn't say know, i mean you know,especially if they pay. that would be totally great you know. but, if somebody remembered meas someone who played many variations of trans character and it got to showthe audience that we come in

all different colours, we come from alldifferent backgrounds. we don't all sound the same, we don't alllook the same, then that would be something that i would be proud of. and yes, like bianca said, i would likethe day where we move past that. i would like to at first get to the point,there is more than two variations of a trans character and then move beyondthe fact that okay, we can realistically expect audience to see an actorthey know to be trans and have them believe that this charactercan play a non trans character. at this point, most of our audiencehave a problem looking at a gay character

and imagine they can be in lovewith a woman on the screen. so part of that is seeing where we areand looking at where the next step is. for me personally the next stepis asking playwrights asking casting directors to see usas varied, we don't sound the same. even here, we're not even allfrom the same ethnicity. and i would like that before being allowedto play something other than just a trans character. you know for me, there was nothingpolitical about theatre, you know, i was a kid that was starstruck,i thought i wanted to be a movie star

and then i went to an acting conservatorythat was theatre based and i fell in love with that. and you know, all i wanted to dowas to play mad margeret and blanche dubois, you know likeany other actor had. that's what i wanted. and after transition, of course thatcomplicated things, but i remember when i first started out, none of us thought it made any senseto transition. and then tell people about it.

on paper, it doesn't make any sense,you know, why would you go through all of this and then just tell people,i'm not really what i appear to be, and over time, that began to changebecause in real life, it is better because for many of us,for some people stuff works just fine. many of us secrets are corrosive. and i remember one day my friend,i had gotten what we called spooked. which means somebody, you know,clocked me, spooked whatever. and i was very upset, and i criedto my friend and because when you see that look in someone's eye, when they seeyou as one thing and--

your value diminishes in their eyes. that's very painful and that's realityfor most of us. we've seen them, we've gone through that. my friends said, you know what,what if this person knows, this person knew you were a transexual,we didn't use the word transgender back then. this person knew you were a transexual,so what? you are a transexualand then-- groups started popping up,people were being out

and trans woman and trans manand the idea of yes, this is what i am and i don't givea flying-- what people think. - you know- bleep. and i think, you know, that--the political, the person became the political and i don't--you know, a lot of the things that i have done and been asked to doare very sociality conscious, you know and that's great, that's fine, i meanthere's always a part of me that just wants that just wants a goodjuicy role, you know. but, a lot of that activism has rubbed offon me and you know,

i see it, i see it with my sisters,i see you without how beautifully we've earned has stepped out to the plate. and yeah, we now look at roles,we look at scripts, we're asked to look at scripts that we're not necessarilygoing to work on and ask for our feedbackand we give it, you know. so, there's many times i've been in a showwhere i've had to say, okay, i'm not speaking to you as an actress,i'm speaking to you as a trans woman. okay, now that issue is done,i'm going to put my actress cap back on, you can tell me shut the fuck up.

- and wait-- can you repeat?- sure. i was just asking aboutthe sort of intersection of political self identification and also wantingto move beyond that and to play a gender specific role. you know what, when i officiallylike affirmed it and owned myself. i have no problem with anyone knowingi was transgender and i took pride in that, because i workedas we all say, as transgender individuals, we work so hard to be who we areand most importantly to just fit in a space where we can feel normal,because we are normal.

as-- you put yourself in a situation,when you go into a--for instance, an acting-- acting scene, you don't wantto be placed into a space where you're wondering,you don't want that. you want to feel completely normal,i would love, i personally would love to seemore day to day things that have to do with trans peopleand they have regular relationships. you know, you don't see that oftenthere are small-- there are small groups that have them,but you don't see them as often. i would like to see that moreand broadcast it on news, on television

because people need to seethat it happens. you can get married, you know,you're not alone for the rest of your life like that's just not what trans people do,that's what the masses think and that's never the case,that's never the case. we can book jobs,we can have relationships. we can have kids, we can survive. we can live, let me fix that, we can live. that's what we can do. - live joyous and free.- exactly.

we can live joyous and freeand there's nothing wrong with that and i think that trans people who arefeeling some type of way about being "trended", i think you shouldkind of be dropped a little bit, because it is shedding light on thisand it's creating a space up of comfortability, because if it wasn'thappening, none of this would be possible. we wouldn't be able to sit up hereand talk about our stories. that's-- i have to agree with thatand i think that if you're an out transgender person, publicly livingyour life, whether you are trying to or not, you are making a politicalstatement, you are involved in that

discussion and it's--you know, i've never sent out to be a transgender activistor advocate. if you told me a year ago thati'd be sitting up here right now doing this, i wouldn't-- i mean it wouldn'thave been on my radar. but it's not something i would say no tobecause it's important and needs to be done,but i still just want to be an actor, like when it's all said and done,book me in a show, pay me to do what i love to do,what i studied to do and i will be happy, i just happenedto be an actor who is transgender

and in a way that has benefited mebecause it is trending right now. it is a topic of conversationand whether you're familiar with it, whether you watch orange is a new black,you know. that there's a transgender characteron the show, whether you like caitlyn jenner, you knowwho she is, you know, five years ago that wasn't the case at alland so, just by having these conversations we are being political, even thoughwe're all really saying or what we sound like we're all saying is we justwant to work, you know, please just book us in theatre or filmor something, that's what we're here for

but also we're trans, so we're goingto talk about this too. so it's kind of-- it's hard to separatethe politics from your personal life. and take us into the rehearsal spaceand the audition room, because i think there's a lotof communication and education certainly from casting directors,artistic directors, the people who basically are the gatekeepers. what are some of the conversationyou would like to have? i know there was donnie, you didsouthern comfort of public theatre and there was discussion at the timewhen sisters and actors were cast in

trans roles and that production. let's talk about what conversationsyou would like to have with artistic directors,with casting directors, what-- let's talk about it. i can talk about that forever,i think, you know, the first place to start it's such an obvious statementis that we need to see more of an effort, we need to see casting directorsand agents and directors make more of an effort if they're looking fora transgender character specifically. prove it, show us, you know,like in southern comfort's case,

it was at the public and it was an equityshow, i was not equity but they held open auditions, so i was able to auditionfor the part and play a transgender character, i had to join equity. you know, it opened the door for mebecause they asked and i don't remember having seen anothercasting call like that, that's not to say there wasn't oneat a different theatre at another city, but that was the first time that i sawcasting call where i went, wow, they're looking for me! that's four or five years afteri've given up doing this

because i didn't think anybodywas going to look for me and the impact not just on my careerbut on me personally, as a human and as somebody who, you know,being transgender, even when it's trendy it's not easy. we have a lot of thingswe have to go through and stupid discriminatory thingsabout where you can pee, i mean just, you all know. so to have somebody say,i see you, i'm acknowledging you and i'm asking you to be a part of this.

for me personally was just an absoluteblessing. so, it's not just a matter of likeaccurate casting that we're asking for, like, you can change the world. you can change the world for a person,my whole world change a year ago for the betterbecause of that opportunity. so, when we say we want to see morefrom you, as a casting director, as an agent, it's not just becausewe really want that part, it's because you can help movethe world in a better direction. and i don't think, you know,when you're looking at something

through a business lens, like okay,i need a big star for this role or i need somebody who's going to selltickets, you're not necessarily thinking of the impact that you could haveon the little guy. on the little trans guy who was living intucson, arizona a year ago, you know, you don't think of thatbut i feel like this is the arts community everyone is welcomed, you know,this is probably-- this is not math or politics or even like engineering,this is the arts, it collects the people who aren't welcomed in other placesand i feel like it's our responsibility to keep casting a wider net to bring inmore people.

because that's what makes this so greatand that's what attracts people to a career in arts, so personally,i would love to see more theatres take that first step,because we're obviously here. so, use us, find us, we want--we want to be found. that's what i would like to seehappen with agents and directors and such. just before we continue,i'd like to ask azure as well, as a play write, where would you liketo see doors opening? so, this is a compound answer,so i didn't answer the last question which was about politics, i want to saythat i definitely identify

as a political person, front jump,like i studied woman and gender studies you know, in grad school, althoughi felt galvanised by theatres, actually with giant monologueslike five times in college, really, yeah. like i was in it four timesand directed it once, it was a co-directing thing,it was terrible. tell them don't have co-directorsfor a show but it was-- like that really, i wasn't sure whati wanted to study in grad school and i was like women and gender studiesand then i went back to grad school for experimental theatre and i think thatyes, like my being influences

my politics, right? because i want to have a nice lifeas i say when i go to things. like in doing racism as like a blackqueer person, who's trans and fat and not binary etc. i would like a nice life,i would like to have a family and not you know, be afraid of thembeing murdered in the streets of [inaudible] so that it's inherentlypolitical, but i'll also say that for me it's all about allocation of resourceslike i feel like people act very confused when it comes to allocation of resourcesright?

like they're down with you until you wantme to do something? with the resources that i have access tooutside of what i've already been doing. so, so-- i'm very clear on this,i actually was at the downhill on gender which was in response to southern comfortat the public because the public theatre got yelled ata lot for casting cis people in trans roles right? which frankly, i heard what they hadto say, still no excuses for it, stop, stop doing it, stop doing it,it's not that hard actually, stop. as an administrator, i understandthe process and still stop it.

so, as a play write, i have to saystop programming plays by cis people about trans people. there's not enough slots in the season,we don't have enough resources nonsense. maybe one day, when all of us are justworking and taking our pick and trying different fruits of our labourand putting the fruit down and saying no that's not for me,i think i'll pass on that one, thank you. then, then we can talk about maybeprogramming these sort of things. or casting a cis people in trans roles,but we don't have in this capitalist society that we've set up,enough resources for all of that nonsense,

so stop doing that and if you want a playabout trans people, then look for some trans writersand also i'll guarantee you, the roles would be more complex,interesting and a better, juicier parts for our talented friends here, right? that's what i have to say about that. i just want to piggyback on that,it is absolutely true for many, many groups in theatre and motion picturesthat, people talk about is it-- you know, is it appropriate? does it help the storyline?

the truth is trans actors wants firstcrack at a trans role. black actors want first crackat the black roles. asians, differently abled people. we want to work, we need to work,and we're asking for it and pretty strongly too. right, and can i just also sayi agree with you as far as that and i want to go specifically intowho they cast as far as the transgender role, which are cis gendered men. - i have nothing against cis gendered men.- i do.

but a cis gendered--(all laughs) - i do.- turn. but, i don't have anything againstcis gendered men but i do have something against themplaying trans role. i wouldn't rather cis gendered womango into a role as me versus a cis gendered male,reason being is because that retracts to us as trans women or vice versawith trans men but specifically towards trans women, it retracts to usas "men in dresses". when men play roles for us,and that's disrespectful to us

and i know that's blunt,but it's true and that's why we need to elevate that thoughtcrosses or what the masses think. when they do that, they create the spaceof the people thinking, oh yeah, they're supposed to be noticeable,no that's not the case. we come in all array of things,we call it, come in all shapes and sizes and that should not be the case for themto just be like we should be detectable. that's disrespectful. if we were played by a cis woman,i mean, we had a wonderful actress, - julianne hoff-- hufman- felicity huffman.

excuse my name, excuse me,yeah felicity huffman, she played-- i thought she dida wonderful job as playing a trans woman and i think she did justice to it. and not to mention,she's a cis gendered woman. a lot of these men that played these rolesis almost like a mockery, it's almost like a mockeryand it's almost like they're doing drag and that's not what we as trans womanare and vice versa if there was a woman to play a trans male. that shouldn't happen.

- can i do a tiny bit add on that?- please. i promise i'm going to keep it short. this summer i got cast as a recurringguest star on a show on usa. a casting was looking for a trans person. they were-- only wanted a trans male,that they expanded it and they wanted it to bea trans character. and in the character breakdown,they had also said we want the character to bea trans character but we will never comment on the fact that the characteris trans and that is the comment

that we're making. i was fortunate enough,i was just the right type, i had the right energy, i cast the roleand for a long time, because i had experiences i'm suremy brother and sisters here have had, you know, this idea that you don't looktrans enough, which is basically-- - that's another problem.- [talking at same time] looks like and you're too feminineor not feminine enough or whatever that is. and i thought that this was goingto be that, i thought well,

if we're not going to comment about it,then how are they going to know that i'm trans? and then i-- what dawned on meis that somebody in the powers that being in that show decidedwe want to give work to trans actors and we don't want to make a mockeryof it, this person has got to be educated, this is person is not going to bestereotypical trans character and we're looking for somebodywho is right for that role and when we got down to the show,i thank the creator of that show. i said you're not a trans person,i'll forgive you for that.

but, the fact that you did not wantto make money off making us miserable, that you wanted to give usan authentic, respectable representation. and to the end of my life,i will remember that at one point in my career, i came across someone,why do you have to do something has to be commercially viable? it's on tv, it has to have audiencesbut they also thought of respecting the people they were showing,that it's a culturally diverse show, you know, the three leads of the show,one person is black, one person is asian,another person is french,

and another person is a jewish man. and i want and i think we all want,we want more people to see that. not thinking, well if we have to havea trans character, then this character has to be patheticso the audience would feel sorry for them. none of us wants anybody to feel sorryfor us. we want to be respected, we want to beacknowledged and we want to be included in society as who we are. so that's my feedback, sorry. no, i would like to also knowthere's been discussion about

how the community in general,healthcare certainly can better support the trans community because i thinkit was an education for me as well to learn that there's a great dealof your journey that goes along that--we don't see on stage the personal journey for a trans actors, there's housing,there's healthcare, things like that that are--some can be barriers to booking a job. your life as an artist can be greatlyaffected by that. how can the arts community,how can healthcare, how can we as a community in generalsupport and better serve

the trans community? can i say i think the most importantthing to me as far as healthcare or anything as far as what perksare involved with whether it be equity or sag. i think there should be some typeof insurance cover for hrt. because that's one of the most--if you do plan on moving forward or not even moving forward. moving to another part of your transition,that's an important part of it. i think that, that should be incorporatedwith these health plans

or health insurance or whatever the casemay be, there are a lot of perks that are given to equity actors,beautiful perks, you get a nice, cute little zip car, you can get a lotof these things, you know i mean. that's what comes with these perks,it's wonderful, but there are certain,you get great insurance on certain things as well,but there's one thing if we're going to be trans actressesand actors within the industry, we need help to-- because some of uscan't afford without those specific essential needs and i think that's oneof them that we need.

okay. i can talk again. being in a theatre, it's one of the placeswhere it's still considered appropriate to cast you based on the waythat you look. like you wouldn't, if you're applyingfor a job at a newspaper, they wouldn't say, what?we need somebody that is over 5"6. but in theatre, that kind of thingis still you know, very specific, you have to look a certain way,theatre thinks, theatre, films any kind of art like that still thinks very binary,it's either male's role or a woman's role.

so there are certain thingsthat you are expected to look like in order to get workand that's just the industry. then there's the rest of the worldwhere there are certain ways that you're expected to lookif you don't want to get, you know, beat up or worse, or if you want to liveyour life happily. these boxes, these gender normsthat people ascribe to you whether you identify that way or not,whether you identify as non binary. people still expect to see youin a certain way. so, in my personal case, i'm pursuingsurgery right now,

it's called top surgery, it's to removethe giant weight on my chest and you have to work a certain numberof weeks in equity in order to get health insurance throughequity and i'm one week shy. so, somebody book me for one weekof a show and right now i'm on medicate, which should be a greatthing since it's new york state and new york state has passeda law, there are medicate guidelines saying that if any medicate like nco,whether you have health first or fidelis has to cover transgenderrelated healthcare and i recently turned down for itwith these plans

and the individual plans are able to likecome up to whatever kind of little hoops they want to make you jump through,you know, they'll deny you the first time then you'll have to appeal,then maybe they'll approve it on the appeal, it can be a really, reallylong process and not only does that affect my life like,this is a safe place i feel good sitting here. when i leave here, as soon as i startwalking down the street and on the subway and i have to go home. i'm looking at everybody because i don'twant to get clocked.

i'm worrying that somebody's goingto notice that my tie doesn't sit flat on my chest, you know? so it affects my life, it also affectsmy job, you know, it's going to affect if i can wear that costume,if i can be cast as a certain role. so, you know, this doesn't have muchto do with the artistic community per say as much as it does as the transgendercommunity, but when you offer the support to transgender peoplethat they need the medical care that is absolutely necessary,it's not a choice, it's not cosmetic, it's not just because you wantcalf implants because you think

they would look cool like medicallynecessary, you're making that person a more positiveand capable member of society. you know? they're going to provide moreto the world because they're healthy and happy now. so, like, mj was saying,since i don't have the health insurance yet, i'm only slightly familiar withwhat equity offers but i know that they don't cover hormone replacementtherapy and things like that. at least that's what i heard. yeah, so, if you want good actorswho are going to really be

at the top of their game becausethey embody their true selves and their authentic identity,then opening doors like that and covering things like that is importantand it's going to benefit you in the long run, it's going to benefityour production and then the arts as a whole. i just want to say not specificallyabout health insurance, but the tremendous pressure on appearance,you know. it's wonderful that we are makingthese great [ingrowns] and you know, both as performersand writers and administrators,

but this is a tough industry,it's a tough business whether you're trans or not and i--a friend of mine was cast in a cable series a few years agoand i call my agent at the time and i said, i didn't even know about this,why didn't you send me on this? she said well, they wanted someonearound 30. i said but, she's the love interest,the leading man is my age. she said, welcome tohollywood dear. i mean, i'll also say that you-- okay, first of all, breakdowns right?

you need to know who you're looking for,you can't find what you're looking for if you don't use the right words, right? so you need to know why we're calledand how we respond, right? what is a trans man?what is a trans woman? what is the difference betweenthose things? and when you say trans man,trans woman and just like jumble them up, it's very like confusinglike we actually don't know if you're talking to us or notbecause well that's-- - is it you or me? which one?--- what now?

so we both get it? no. so make sure that your breakdownsays what you want it to say, just basically for the entire industrymaybe have somebody look at and just tell you if you're beingoffensive. - right.- just tell you if you're being offensive like make that someone's job whetherjust like i'm going to tell you the truth here that's not what those peoplewould like to be called. you know, so there's that but alsowell i know trans people who are working, who are doing very well, but-- butyou don't feel good when they book

those jobs, right? because they go in the theatre,they're constantly misgendered. right? like it's not okay to invite usto your house and then not treat us respectfully, okay? so you need to keep the pronouns,i have lots of feelings about-- and suggestions for thatand one of the biggest ones which i think is radical because there'sa socialisation to be nice about it and to coach people is to practice, right? we learn our lines,you learn your lines, right?

so you get a singing partnerand you practice until you get those pronouns right, because i don't wantto hear it. that's-- i mean really, go do thatsomewhere else, because like the moment it slips out of your mouth,it's ruined the entire interaction and although i might smile and be like,aww, yeah it's hard sometimes. no i haven't forgottenand it's really ruined the experience, make sure they're bathrooms that peoplecan use, which means that you may want to ask people what kind of bathroomthey would like to go. i like a single stall, right?

because i like privacy in the bathroomno matter what i'm doing in there. i don't want another person in therewith me. so, like those basic things, but also,pay people please, pay people. i understand-- listen i'm an emergingplay write, i understand how there's not any money, but i feel like peopleare especially looking for trans woman of colour and trans woman of colourof a certain age and they're like looking and looking,and like we can't find her, where is she? and i'm like you know,she needs to eat, right like we need to eat,we need to pay these bills

and also people say that,i can't find a trained actor, like well okay, they do exist so,but also-- like are you calling them the right thing, you know first of all. but also how do you expect peopleto have the experience to stay up on their game, when they're not gettingthe work, they're not getting paid right? so really thinking about quality of life,human rights, how you would like to experience it and if you can't seethose things because you have a blindspot, then again you need to have somebodyto come in and say, no that's not-- no no. then that costume fitting is like maybeeveryone just needs to have their own

private moment, do you have like a shadeor something? oh and also costuming, and i say thatalso as lifelong fat person. your costume, people will need to be on itand be respectful. so first of all, they do need to read upand maybe you do need some extra room in the chest for me, like maybeyou do need to know how to like deal with all of this, you know? there's junk in the trunkand like these thighs. also be respectful about it, right? so i don't want to hear abouthow hard it is for you to make a suit.

or what you need to do,what kind of undergarments we need to make sure everythingis staying where we want it to be while we're on stageand also that when these lights hit us, we're not seeing things,that we can't see, right? so like have our backswhen it comes to that. and that shouldn't even be a question,like that's a professional job, we do our jobs as professionalslike you said to act, to sing, they should know exactly what they need,if you don't know how to say it. i was always hard on saying it all.

you do your job and when you do your job,you get promotion -- i feel like we all just want to feel likedignified professionals. - right.- that's really it and so it's like if you need to tell me that, you know,like my binding as slipped or something like, that's fine,there's a way to do that like right we have ways to tell actorsthat we're having a problem with our costumesand like that's totally fine but like just remember thatwe all deserve dignity and so we should all have each other'sbacks and also-- we also want you

to have a dignified interaction with uslike we don't want you to be like out there looking stupid,so like, again, maybe have a consultant or somebody who's on that jobto help you interact with us. and i think this panel is a great startin getting that dialogue going, but individually, how are each of you wantto see more trans will become in powered positions? how do we get more trans peopleto become decision makers, who are casting. how to make sure the casting directorsare talking to the trans community,

that you've got someone who's an executivedirector or an artistic director, i mean we've got [shakeen iniafac]who is a great wonderful ally and she's running her own companyright now, she has made sure there's roomfor trans writer in her development series but what's the way forward? i think we need to start a step,well all of us, trans or non trans. i think we need to start developinglike a genuine relationship and getting understanding,and once you get an understanding, then i feel like, especially withinthe industry,

everyone has context, everyone has,whether they be called good or bad, it's called a context and once you startcreating that revenue for moving forward and pressing forward and making thingshappen, i think if you put that on a certain platform, it's going to gofarther than would you ever even thought. but we need to start in a genuine placeof creating friendships and camaraderie. if we don't have that,that's not going to happen. there's no togetherness, that's not goingto happen and yeah, thats what i think, that's the thing that needs to happen. you have to be genuine,you have to create, you have to be

in a space where you know you feel safe. whether it be trans or non trans,when you do that, moves forward and i say this it may sound cheesyand i don't care because i truly believe it, we have to start lovingwithout conditions honey. we love too much with conditions,we love each other with too many conditions. it sucks, we need to start lovingeach other without them and i promise you,when we start doing that as a whole, things will move forward.

they will. i think, you know, i come froman acting point of view, but i really thing that the next stepreally is getting more trans people in the writers room and programming moreplays by trans writers, you know, trans directors, hire an assistanttrans director, you know. get a trans camera person. but like you said in those positionsof power. transparent has jonnah, they specificallywanted a trans person in the writers room and they searched for one and she didn'thave experience doing that,

she was taught and now she's part of it. and trans people in casting offices,you know, casting directors can't find someone, there are trans people out therethat can help them find someone. there's no excuse anymorebecause most agents that i work with, they know someone on callthat they can send, because there's so much work. and like i said, those positions of powerand influence, very, very important. if a trans actor playing a trans rolebrings an authenticity then, imagine what happens when the writerof a trans story is trans.

i like to-- we have about five minutesleft, are there any questions? that anyone would like to--hi down the front. (audience) i'm just curious to what,since all of you identify as actors in some way, what your dream roleswould be. the question is what--every artist up here, what their dream role would be. oh, well, it's been this since i was tenand my transitions is not going to change it so the witch in into the woods. (all laughs and claps)

oh you guys are going to laugh,i'm an eighties kid, i grew up with dynasty, i--i always thought that if they redo it, you know what, i'm just perfectto play the head bitch. i even have the right colouring. i want to do a big budget,action thriller, opposite tom hardy. (all laughs)- well who wouldn't? you asked. well, since i'm a theatre girl,clearly i want peggy like i just want that the main one that i know that i woulddeliver in is glinda,

i want to be glinda in wickedand i know i would deliver the devourment. right? that would be amazing, sorry. interesting, you know, i don't reallythink of myself as an actor in other people's playsanymore, i mean circling back round the leadership, i would love to bethe artistic director in somebody's theatre, so that's a nice role. for me, i'm sorry i'm really passionateabout literacy management but i write my own work now,so, i don't necessary see myself

in my own work, but sometimes,and i would love for one of my plays to be up at soho rep, the public,i like the role as playwright on opening nights. (all laughs)- so yeah. hi, here on the end. (audience) so, is there an out, [inaudible] i'm also a commercial theatre producerand television producer and i serve on the national lgbt workfor [inaudible], so i got all that out. conditioned a really big williams's studytwo years ago, [inaudible]

and over five thousand responded,which we send out surveys in people's homes to fill out in the privacyof their own home we only had seven people within[inaudible] identified as trans. in our survey and for me servingon that board, doesn't make up my entire life, i have prejudiceand also work and deal with it [inaudible] it really disappointing to me,to just know that we only had-- i know at least a dozen trans actorsin [inaudible] trans actors just here in new york city, nonetheless,in the entire country. for me it was very sad and upsettingto know that in the safety

of one's own home, they couldn'teven check that box and me serving in the national committeeof this very big union, although it's not theatre, it's connectjob, it's like i just thought what can we do to make us all feelsafer and better so that we can live authentically and make the worldaccept us in a more authentic level. and i just wondered what your thoughtson that were, because it's all about, i've said that, you know, when you're notbeing honest and you're creating a difficult place for one's self,so i just wonder what your thoughts on that were.

you know, i just want to say thatat first i thought you were coming from a scolding place and you're not,but i do think it is important and, for a trans artist if this sort of--it works both ways and we have to show up for thingsthat, you know like, filling out paperwork and things like that, surveysand doing things. it's very important, you know. mj and i have been cast in a play,there's going to be an art in january and jo bonney is the directorand paul lucas the writer. they sent out the breakdown,after breakdown, after breakdown,

after breakdown, they flew to differentcities looking for trans actors and the response they got was really,really poor and when i-- it was to be-- one person's agent said she's notinterested in doing theatre. you know it's true, you get to a pointyou do pick and choose and that's great. but, there are the casting agentsthat say they didn't and didn't really try but i know these people really triedand the response was underwhelming and i think it's important that we--we have to show up, we have to show up. we're not all going to be the nextlaverne cox

and even laverne cox did a lot,a lot of theatre, she had a lot of small theatre and even independent films,so when the big moment arrives, she is ready and i think trans performers,especially young trans performers they have to realise we have to payour dues just like anybody else. and we have to show up. we have time for one more question,in the hat, yeah? (audience) a lot of the mainstreamrecent issues are all transgenders people, but generally about whitetransgender people, there seems to be a lot of people of colour that are transin the mainstream films

tangerine. why is there a lot in these films? can i ask her to repeat the question? so the question is aboutthe lack of diversity in mainstream films about trans characters, specificallyracial diversity. i feel like intersectionalityis so important, right? so we're here to talk about trans theatreartist but when you ask this question about leadership, i'm thinking aboutwho's the-- because when i look for opportunitiesin places,

i look at their leadership, i go seewho's in charge here and i see a place where it's likewhite people, white people, white people, white peopleand it's like, okay, so it may or may not be a permanent seat for me at the table,this may be like a table you just set up and put out a paper plate on for mein this moment because it's not permanent part of your agenda. i think think we really have to look athiring practices and who we're really putting in the positions of power,so that consistently there's a support. i know we have a race problemin this country, right?

absolutely, so then we have peoplewho are multiply marginal like okay, so yes we have tangerine,that's what we have, but-- i feel you on that one i've seenand this is no way bashing any caucasian person, we all deserve a rolebut there's the sad reality that we as african americansor people who are muitlracial or colour, we're not seenand some of that is because some of us like we don't need to be seenbecause it's already happening and we're like, okay they got it already,we're not going to--

that's the mentality because that's beeninstilled in us. but there needs to be,that door needs to be opened and there needs to be an accepting hugor whatever to let us know and reassure us that we are deservingof being in a more mainstream or big tv or theatre shows,but right now we don't have that, we don't have those groups telling usgo and auditions and that retrospects as far asafrican american, i feel this is such a--this is so like touchy but that word privileged trickles inand it shows within the screen

and sometimes that's just the way it isbut i feel like we just have to work harder to show that, there doesn't needto be any privilege and if you do have it, it needs to beequal and we can have that priviledge as well. hope that made sense. well especially when you're doingdiversity programming, so i know last night the playwrightsand their identity panel, they were talking about like black historymonth and that's your slot right? and we're looking at what is gettingprogrammed and i'm talking more

theatrically here, i am a theatre makerand that's my work. but also, it's kind of the same thingfor hollywood, like we get like the one movie a year, you know.. let's go find the black hottieand put them in that one movie we got teraji in them right? so if that's what we get, likeblack people we get one, two movies is like that's what we get? it's not going to be trans movie right? it's not going to be a moviewhere they're dealing respectfully

with trans character, so i feel likewe really got to look at this intersectionality because when we blow itopen, so that there's more space for all these stories. then we get the nuance and the layeringof things but when we get one trans story,it's going to be a white trans story. if we get one black story, it's goingto be cis story, you know. because they ain't ready right now,but they need to get ready. and with that unfortunately,i wish we had more time to talk, but i think that's a great way to end it.

at least there's always something to thinkabout since we leave. i want to thank everyone of theseincredible panelist for joining us tonight as an honour [inaudible]. (all claps) and thank you all for coming.